PTO Today

Hi..

I wanted to know whether there are any legal raminfications when leaving a PTA?

Additionally, is there a waiting time to change Bi Laws when you first become a PTO?

Do fees have to be paid to any State or federal orgainization when there is a change your of the Bi Laws?

Is there any State or Federal agency/organization which records or tracks the Bi law changes ?

Can a school be removed from the PTO organization because they change their Bi-laws within the first 5 years of beginning as as that organization?

thanks,

Hi PTOmommie --

I think you'll do well to take some time and read some of the PTO v PTA frequently asked questions that we have on this site. Link = http://www.ptotoday.com/ptovpta.html

The often-misunderstood detail is that you are not actually changing your PTA into a PTO. So, for example, you're not amedning your PTA bylaws into PTO bylaws. Rather, you're doing two completely separate things. 1. You're winding down/disbanding a PTA. Instructions for that for the most part are in your PTA bylaws. 2. You're starting an entirely new organiztion, your new PTO.

The PTO can have its own bylaws, the rules for changing/amending those bylaws will actually be in those new bylaws (does that make sense?), and your rules/systems (provided you're not breaking any laws) are up to you guys.

You can change your bylaws as often as you like with no fees. There is no "PTO organization" to be drummed out of, as each PTO is independent.

Hope that helps.

Tim

Tim.. this does help.. Our PTO president stated that we were unable to change by-laws without incurring a fee [$70.00 for one line] and since we switched from a PTA to PTO last year we have to wait 5 years before changing our by laws or we would be getting checks against us by someone [whom she did not specify] and that we could be kicked out of the organization if there were too many checks against us.. I gather this is not correct..

Does the PTO have to register with the State [of NJ] and does the State keep track of when by laws are changed?? thanks

Yes, your PTO president is incorrect.

As far as I know, there is no New Jersey state government agency that tracks PTO bylaw changes, no.

Tim

Hi,

I am the Community Liaison at an elementary school where the PTA has been slowly dying for several years. This is due in part to a change in our population. When my kids first started going to the elementary school where I now work, we had a very strong PTA, but I'm talking 15 years ago. The PTA does not seem to be able to keep up with the changes in population that most of us are facing now. We have families who were never really asked to be part of the decision making group in the PTA of the past but are now being recruited because there is no one else. Does the PTA think these families are stupid? We are desperatly trying to change things. The one thing I keep getting as an excuse to stay with the PTA is insurance but it seems to me that the insurance you get through the PTA isn't worth the paper it's written on. Am I wrong? I've been told that we need more than the minimum 25 members to get PTA insurance. We are going to try a Co -PTA - PTO for this year.

The PTA insurance typically is worth the paper it is written on, but -- that said -- it's still not a reason to stay PTA. PTOs have fine insurance options (with the same coverages), as well.

I'd recommend against having both a PTA or PTO. It will just confuse your general parent population further.

Tim

I am the Community Liaison at an elementary school where the PTA has been slowly dying for several years. This is due in part to a change in our population. When my kids first started going to the elementary school where I now work, we had a very strong PTA, but I'm talking 15 years ago. The PTA does not seem to be able to keep up with the changes in population that most of us are facing now. We have families who were never really asked to be part of the decision making group in the PTA of the past but are now being recruited because there is no one else. Does the PTA think these families are stupid?

This is not a PTA vs PTO problem, but more a problem of the parents involved not keeping up. Will these same "leaders" be involved in a PTO? Then what will change?
If they are an entrenched "old guard" whoi resist change, then it is time for change! How about if the "left out" parents take over the PTA? Could that work?
The goal is INVOLVEMENT not "A" or "O"

I'd like to respond to PTOmommie- I too live in NJ and we did make the switch about 3 years ago. As far as a fee, we were told by the IRS if we changed our bylaws we would have to then change our wording on our articles of incorp., charitable registrations and the gaming dept. All of which received copies of our by-laws. The different departments in Newark can and will charge you.Thanks to the IRS, we had to make a change and they did charge us $70.00 to change our paperwork!Remember every time you make a change, you need to send copies to all the different departments that need them.


We were also told, as all other groups are told, that you only receive temporary non-profit status for 5 years. At which point you apply for permanent status. As for getting strikes against you, thanks not entirely true. The IRS did say something similar to me. I was told that should you make too many changes or problems they don't have to award you permanent status. Which to me means leave us alone and we'll leave you alone.

I do have a few questions for you- who came up with your by-laws?A group or just one individual? Did the membership, as a whole, have a chance to review the new by-laws and then vote on them?Since you are a new group, why don't you give the the by-laws a chance to work before making changes? And what don't you like about the by-laws? Do they not reflect what's best for the school environment or do they reflect what's best for a few individuals? How does the rest of the Executive Board feel about the by-laws? And how about the general membership, how do they feel about them?

I know there are a few of us here from NJ that either made the change or are thinking about it. Let's see if some of them can also help out. I know they were very helpful to me years ago when I needed the help!

Wow, "smiles", that's a pretty harsh post. It sounds like your group is going through some growing pains as you make the PTA to PTO switch.

The reason for places like this forum is for people to annonymously ask for help, clarification, support or to just blow off a bit of steam. Mostly, the number one rule is "Play nice."

You and PTOMOMMIE seem very passionate about PTO work and the future of your team. Surely there is room for both of you. Fighting it out here in a very public forum doesn't serve either of you and has proven in the past to be quite ineffective.

Right now, you're coming at this from opposite sides. Perhaps a meeting with the school principal or third party mediator will help everyone involved in this huge change to come through it positively and with the best interests of the school and students in mind.

__________________
“Some people come into our lives and quickly go. Some stay for awhile and leave footprints on our hearts. And we are never, ever the same.”

I have to agree with Chief. That was harsh. Since the two of you know each other might I suggest talking it out- off the boards of course.

This really is a place to share ideas and occasionally disagree.You have to keep in mind what's best for the school environment. I really can't stress that enough. There are times that I have to say no to myself. Because after all, it's not about me, it's about the kids & the school. And if changing the bylaws is best for the school than do it. But if you are trying to change them for selfish reasons, then it's for the wrong reasons.

Anyway, you two have fun working this out-off the boards- and remember we are here if you need us!