PTO Today

Hi all,

New here, great site. I have been reading through all the blogs. Here is our situation:

Our school has been PTA for many years. About three years ago we voted to become a PTO instead. We filed with the IRS, got our 501(C)3 PTO number, our state tax exempt #as PTO, new bylaws and such. We never really dissolved our PTA properly until last year (or so we thought.) This year we received a letter from PTA saying we were deliquent asking for dues. Our treasurer looked into things and discovered that our bank checking account is still under the PTA # but the checks have the name PTO on them! So we have been operating as a PTO, but all our financial transactions at the bank have been going thru under the PTA# for the past three years.

How do we fix this? Are we best to pay PTA dues for this year, file all our IRS forms under the PTA# this year and of course change the name on the checks back to PTA? Then open up another account under our PTO federal number, write checks out of the PTA account, put deposits into the PTO account. Once the PTA account is drained, formally dissolve the PTA once again?

I am thinking it is easier and less confusing to stay a PTA until the bank funds are down to zero, than to explain to the IRS that we have been conducting business as a PTO using a PTA #.

As it is our treasurer panicked because of a March 31st deadline on the PTA deliquent letter and sent them a check for membership dues. Funny thing is the state PTA office called wondering why we are sending them a check when we sent them a dissolution letter last year. (this is the same office that sent us the deliquent letter). OH they seem as confused as we are. They are holding the check until we meet with them.

Any advice would be appreciated greatly.

I am not an expert on this at all but my advice would be to go to the bank and have them open a new account for you filed the proper way and just transfer all the money from your old account to the new one.

If I understand what you are saying you are legally and fully operating as a PTO with everything you need minus this glitch on your bank account. If that is the case I don't imagine the IRS is going to have a problem at all. The IRS really does not spend too much time combing over PTO's looking for issues. Besides it does not change your status with the IRS in that your group does not pay or owe the government any money. Besides the bank may be helpful as well in answering some of your questions regarding the status of your account and how it affects you. If you were no longer a PTA then I am just not sure why you paid the dues. You should have just responded to them that you are no longer a PTA. Especially since you are saying the PTA office you spoke to is as confused as you are. I am glad to hear they are holding the check because they should not cash it unless you want to convert back.

Oh man.... it was purely a techical error. You did virtually everything right. No need to go through more rigamarole.

I would have simple changed the TAX ID# on the bank account or -- if the bank would rather -- I would have opened a new account with the new ID# and transferred funds from the first account to the second (and then officially closed the first).

Don't get caught up in a bunch of more work. You guys are fine. I'd simply ask for the check back from state PTA.

Tim

Thanks so much! In addition to what I already told you I just found out that we haven't filed 990 forms since we became a PTO also and yes we have gross receipts way over $25,000, but less that $100,000 every year. I'm wondering if we need outside help filing these. What do you think? Should we go to an accountant?

One other quick question, do PTAs have to fill out 990 forms at all? If so, we never did them when we were a PTA either.

Thanks again, have a great day!

Yes, the PTA and PTO requirements are the same for that issue. Great example of how the "but the PTA will keep you all buttoned up" argument doesn't work. It's all about what you guys do locally.

RE: your past filings. I'd actually contact the IRS helpline. I suspect they'll tell you to file now and "don't do it again". They're typically very helpful. Don't think you'll need professional help.

Tim

When we had a problem with a treasurer not getting things filed appropriately, we found a parent who was an accountant and he took care of all the paperwork. I think the "tax stuff" scares some people, so if you can find a professional who is willing to do the work for you for free, I say take them up on it.

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Hey Rocky, watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat.

I also suggest contacting the IRS for help. We had to do it a few years back as a new treasurer realized that they had been filing wrong for years. Don't be afraid to contact them. They were very helpful in helping the new treasurer get everything done correctly.

Goodness sakes, megley3. You certainly are on a roll this afternoon. Lucky for the many posters and viewers here that the PTO Today staff helps squash the PTA myths and propaganda that occasionally get dumped here. Thousands of dollars in fines? Really?

I've worked with the IRS on many different projects and find them to be extremely helpful with folks who are trying to do the right thing. Using the general distrust or fear that most folks have of the IRS to further propagate your agenda is shameful and less than truthful. Tsk Tsk

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“Some people come into our lives and quickly go. Some stay for awhile and leave footprints on our hearts. And we are never, ever the same.”

I know for a fact the PTAs have received fines from the IRS 990 forms not being done or done properly. There are resources for the PTAs to have help with all of the forms such as Charities, IRS, Incorporation, etc. I am just wondering about the resources that the PTO offers. It comes up alot about PTA and PTO. I understand that they can go to the companies and receive help as well, but I want to know where the help is in PTO. Does a representative come out to a meeting when you have problems...to help? I want to know what the benefit is in becoming a PTO.

Whether or not it's a benefit to become a parent group independent of the PTA is entirely up to the individual group making the decision and many factors need to be considered.

You make reference to "The PTO" as if they're the same type of entity as "The PTA". It's apples and oranges.

I might point out the contradictory nature of your last post. If the PTA network is so strong, capable and caring of their local groups, why do many of them find themselves in trouble with the IRS, fines, fees and such? Wouldn't it be better to get the help [I]before[/I] the problem rather than [I]after[/I]?

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“Some people come into our lives and quickly go. Some stay for awhile and leave footprints on our hearts. And we are never, ever the same.”