PTO Today

First time to the message board and I am looking for some advice. We started the lengthy conversion from PTA to PTO last fall. We have run the 2 organizations simutaneously until the process was complete. We now have bylaws,have spent our PTA account down and have been incorporated and the only thing that we lack before voting to disbar the PTA is our 501C3. Now the problem. Our by laws were due to be updated for the PTA in March. We weren't aware and suddenly got a letter from PTA saying that our tax exempt status was cancelled for the entire past school year. Is that legal? We have been very careful to keep the accounts seperate and the only time we used our tax exempt status when purchasing items was from the PTA account. I would understand from March since that was when it was deliquent but for the entire school year. I don't want the hassle of updating by laws for an organization that we are getting ready to disband but I don't want any issues with tax exempt status. Is this a threat tactic? Our PTA is known to be very difficult to work with and they know that we have started the conversion process and are very unhappy that they are losing our dues.
Thoughts?

Tell 'em too bad so sad.

Your now a PTO and no longer affiliated with PTA.

If any $$$ is legitamitely owed PTA send 'em a check with a 'Thank you' and Goodbye


Previous years and organizations have NO bearing what so ever on your new separate organization

SOunds like more PTA bullypulpit BS to me

__________________
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Yeah, I don't see any problem there at all.

I assume you paid your PTA dues this past school year? If yes, the above sounds like complete bunk.

You guys did things well and properly. Move on and keep doing great things for kids.

Tim

You don't have to have your 501C3 before totally disbanding your PTA status. Just move on and consider that as a sign that it's time. Walk away from the PTA status and begin your PTO. You can work as a PTO without the 501C3. Our school had for years. They only had the state tax exemption. We are in the process of applying now.

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Doing it for my one and only ~~ my son!

I just had a meeting with the principal and District Cheif officer, we are a PTO, our principal want us to change to a PTA, we have already told her no. Our bylaws protects us from have principal and teachers from trying to take over our parent group, we also have teachers that feels the same way. They told me that the District has a guideline we must follow to write our bylaws, and they must include all teachers as members, never mind if they total the whole population. Now these will give them full control of our PTO. We are facing crap. The principal threaten to take our bylaws down to the District to have them changed. I told we have a PTOtoday where she can get the answers about the difference between PTA and PTO. She stated that there is no Organization that is recognized as PTO can some one please help me with the answer to these and tell me how I can get information about PTO and how it works as a organization. This District only recognize PTAs

Hi LeeAnn --

We've seen this before, but it's usually solved with some education.

A lot of district folks and principals don't realize that the vast majority of parent groups in nevada and nationwide are indpendent groupsa and doing great. There's a ton on this site that you can share. Seems you need to find the right folks and help them learn.

I'm happy to help, too, if they'd like to discuss with anyone.

They're right that there is no formal PTO membership organization (though our PTO Today Plus service -- ptotoday.com/plus -- mirrors many similar benefits to a membership organization).

Quick note: that "all teachers must be considered as members" bylaw actually wouldn't fly as a PTA (where membership is based strictly on who pays dues) but actually could be used as a PTO. One typical PTO membership definition is something like: "all parents and guardians and teachers of students at XYZ school and all staff members of XYZ school are considered members of the XYZ PTO." But PTA bylaws would not allow that language.

Tim

"We weren't aware and suddenly got a letter from PTA saying that our tax exempt status was cancelled for the entire past school year. Is that legal? We have been very careful to keep the accounts seperate and the only time we used our tax exempt status when purchasing items was from the PTA account."

well not sure, but tax exempt and 501c(3) are two different items! Most states have a "tax exempt" for re-sale and charitable groups. This means you don't pay sales tax. This tax exempt is not usually controlled by the State PTA.
Your 501c(3) status as a non-profit with the IRS is usually granted under the umbrella of the State PTA. This could be what they refered to.

Agree that the 501c3 status is under the PTA umbrella, but if the PTA dues were paid and the group was still a PTA, PTA can't go back and retroactively say that you weren't a 501c3 PTA for X time period. That's the bunk part. Just doesn't work that way.

Tim

Leeann, You may be confusing having teachers as members with having teachers as Executive Board members. Our PTO has teachers as members of the PTO. However, they are not on our executive board and only attend as teacher liaisons to our meetings. We have several as contacts for community service projects or grade level projects, but they do not act as chairpersons. It's OK that teachers can be members of the PTO, but I do understand the concern with them being board members holding positions on the PTO.
You need to have detailed discussions with Administration to clearly state all expectations and also check with other schools within the district as to how they are set up.

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Doing it for my one and only ~~ my son!

Regarding the bylaws and losing tax exempt status....I've never heard of the state or the IRS revoking tax exempt status due to an overdue bylaw update. If your bylaws haven't changed, they don't need to be updated in the eyes of the IRS or state. It seems overly harsh for PTA to threaten to revoke a legal status based on an overdue bylaw update. And it seems to be outside their control if your original tax-exempt status was filed correctly, even as an umbrella of national PTA. Just speculating, though, I've never been involved in a PTA myself.

"Tax exempt" is a label used both by state (exempt from state sales tax) and federal (exempt from federal income tax, i.e. IRS). The term "non-profit" isn't really a federal label, but rather a term applied by a state based on the organization's status as a federally-recognized tax-exempt entity. We all use the terms interchangeably, but they mean two differnt things. For example, in our state, we can be incorporated as a non-profit entity, but not yet registered as a federally-recognized tax-exempt charity. It's a bit confusing, but sometimes important to clarify.

And regarding teachers as members of the PTO...all our teachers (AND parents) are automatically members of our PTO according to our bylaws. We don't charge dues. We have many teachers who are also parents in our school, but in 10 years, I've never seen a teacher run for PTO office, whether or not they are a parent. I don't worry about our teachers taking over the PTO.