PTO Today

I am a concerned parent who had several issues to discuss at our last local pto meeting for my children's school. The principal of the school ran the meeting, there were no Robert's Rules of Order being followed and once I was finally! recognized there were teacher's heckling and harassing me while I was speaking. I was getting to one of my main points and when another parent spoke up and asked the teachers to please allow her to hear me they immediately adjourned the meeting while I was in midsentence and walked out of the gym where we were holding the meeting. My questions are these: 1. Are principals allowed to participate in PTO meetings and more importantly run! the meetings? 2. There were only two parents on the board of officers, one was president and one was vice president and I was told that they do not hold elections, they just swap roles from year to year, is this acceptable practice? 3. Can concerned parents over ride the current PTO board and form a new one, like a coup?LOL!

I'm sorry you had that negative experience.

A PTO can be anything from an informal committe-like extension of the school that is totally controlled by the principal to a fully independent 501(c)(3) tax exempt organization set up as a qualified charitable organization.

While there are common practices many of us share, PTOs are are not affilated with any national/state group and there are no set "rules" and no governing authority. Most of us would expect to operate with bylaws, annual elections, and basic parliamentary procedure at meetings. But there's nothing to say a PTO must do those things.

It's a long shot, but you can check with your school district to see if they have any district level policies on how a parent group should be run.

In a situation like yours, change usually occurs because:

1. Parents interested in change become active in the organization and help it evolve slowly over time;
2. Parents who feel strongly enough band together to agressively voice their concerns regarding how things are run, basically forcing change;
3. The school gets a new principal or some new administrative guidance affords an opportunity to start fresh.

Or...it just continues on as is.

So, yes, a coup is possible. Will it work/be effective? No guarantees.

Good luck.

thank you for your responce. I will take that info. under advisement and try to get other parents involved.

You didn't mention what issues you were raising. Were they of significance to the whole group? Maybe your concerns would be more appropriate for a private meeting with the principal.

If in fact it was the principal who ran the meeting, how is it it was adjourned like that? sounds like the prinicpal was not in control, or didnt take control, or didnt run it properly. RRO or not is immaterial, common courtesy and respect should prevail.
It sounds like weak leadership issue...STAFF heckles a speaker, and the boss doesnt put a stop to it?? especially if the boss is alsoleading the meeting??? It just sounds like something is not right......I wonder what future there is in doing something like you suggest, You HAVE TO have the full support of the principal or youll never get anywhere.

parentsof7,

Whenever I see things like this there are a couple of questions that immediately come to mind:

1. Is the school private or public?

2. Is the group a true "PTO"? A PTO is usually a non-profit, 501(C)(3) organization. It has it's own tax exempt number, indicating that it is not controlled by the school or the town.

3. Does the group have Bylaws? If so, they should have answers to many of the questions that you are asking. If not, then it is always recommended that a group create them.

Now let me explain why these questions are important...

If the school is private it really diminishes the ways to rectify the situation. If the school is public then the Principal has a boss and the town likely has a School Committee, and there is a Superintendant of Schools. If you can't get satisfaction through the Principal you have recourse.

If the group is not a true "PTO", meaning that it is not it's own non-profit organization and is instead controlled by the school, then I would say that the Principal controlling the meeting would make more sense. If the group is it's own non-profit then that is extremely odd and it sounds as though the President isn't doing her jab and/or is in the pocket of the Principal.

Most non-profit 501(C)(3) organization do have their own set of Bylaws that should explain things like the proper way to hold elections, when they are held, who controls the organization, terms of ofice, etc. As a member of the group, again if it is a non-profit 501(C)(3), then each member should have the right to see the Bylaws. Mind you I have heard horror stories regarding members trying to obtain their groups, but I would ask these questions to the President.

One avenue that you can try is your town hall. I know that my group's status is kept on file there, and possibly even a set of the Bylaws (though I post it on the website for all to see).

I am actually very interested in what the topic was that you brought up that caused the Principal to adjourn the meeting. I would also say this...

If that happened to me I would have approached the Principal immediately after the meeting. If I did not get the respect or the attention that one would deserve in this situation I would have a letter written to the town's Superintendant of Schools within the hour and would be waiting for him at his office the next morning. So I can understand your disdain with the situation. Have you approached the Principal in regard to what happened?

Let us know.

PresidentJim

Jim - I'd have to disagree with you on that point. My experience is that only a small percentage of parent groups are organized as 501(c)(3)'s. Most are fairly informal. Some mirror a 501(c)(3) structure but have never formalized by filing. I'd be suprised if 10% of non-PTA parent groups were incorporated and/or 501(c)(3) organizations.

JHB--I was in a meeting tonight and someone said that 501c3s are required to have a CPA audit each year...I'd never heard of that before...while we do an audit it is not a CPA one....do you know if that is true oh wise one..

Now perhaps she meant in VA the State required it if we were incorporated but even that I don't think is true...d

The IRS doesn't require any audit, cpa or otherwise. You do have to complete the annual Form 990/990EZ, but that's basically a summary of where you money came from and went for the year, definately not an audit.

I agree with JHB about the organizational status of PTOs. "PTO" is a generic term that means school parent group not affiliated with National PTA. PTOs come in all types: formal 501c3 with hundreds of volunteers down to fly by the seat of pants groups of a handful of members. There is no official, legal definition of the term "PTO".

Going back to the original post...if parents7 PTO has officers, and they let the principal run the show, then they are partly at fault for poor meeting management. It's the job of the president to "preside", not sit back and let another member take over (principal or otherwise). I still wonder what the issue was that was being presented. If the principal and teachers really behaved that unprofessionally, shame on them. But if the issue had nothing to do with PTO, maybe ending the meeting was the right thing to do so others could be excused (though it could have been adjourned with more tact).

I guess what I meant about the PTO accronym and being a 501(C)(3) is that the "PTO" nomenclature is just a name applied to a non-profit organization. Unlike the PTA accronym which indicates that you are part of the national organization. If a group has not filed their independant status then then are likely either falling under the school, under the town or are actually illegal (meaning to be tax exempt you need a number).

I'll agree that the PTO term is thrown around by many groups, even when they may not offically be one (meaning they fall under another group, such as the school or the town).

Personally I would recommend that everyone check what their status is and to investigae filing to become a true 501(C)(3). That way you are 100% independant, 100% legal and 100% in control.

Good luck,
presidentJim